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Evolution

2nd floor is not displaying

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Seems like every time I open HD Pro 10 something changes. OK so I KNOW IT's ALL MY FAULT. Just that I can't figure out WHY?

Since I was attempting to do a better job at building a manual dormer, I decided I'd practice on a new blank plan, and since I need it for the current "Hip with turn out" as-built I am working on I started with a 50'X50' box.

using this tutorial http://www.homedesignersoftware.com/support/article/KB-00358/ to build a story and half, I created a blank 2nd floor. It looked just fine walls and all.

In my 1st floor I set up the roof line with the upper lower pitches etc. Did a Perspective full over view, wow it looked so good.

Back to the 2nd floor, so I went to 2nd floor, but walls do not display. I looked at display preferences and all the floor related options appear to be turned on, so; I am not sure why the 2nd floor walls that were created BY THE SOFTWARE, are not showing up.

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2 guesses would be:

when you built the 2nd blank floor you set the ceiling height to 0" hence no walls built when you built the Roof

 

you checked the box to ignore the 2nd floor ( so roof is built off 1st floor wall plates and ignores 2nd floor walls etc)

 

the 3rd would be you didn't build any walls on 2nd floor yet? ( you built Blank not Derived from 1st floor)

 

*****Just looked at that tutorial and you have what was expected ....you ignored the 2nd floor , if you followed the Tut.? now you need to adjust the 2nd floor and get the ceiling and knee walls..... I did note in the Tut. that they Derived the 2nd floor , and didn't use a blank floor (like when doing a Cupola) as you said you did.

 

edit : the Floor surfaces circled in Pic 2 only refer to the Flooring eg carpet/hardwood etc , not the Floor level.

 

Mick.

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Thanks Mick, but I didn't check ignore second floor, and set the wall height at 12". I think what happen is selecting "blank" 2nd floor. I went back and this time built the second floor from derive from first floor. Now the 2nd floor walls are there, and I was able to build the roof line.

 

So, now it's dormer time: http://www.homedesignersoftware.com/support/article/KB-00396/ Again following the tutorial, up to the point where the walls are supposed to build after creating and sizing the roof hole, however; all I get is a hole with no exterior walls. There must be some detailed instructions missing!?!? I so believe I've followed this to a "T". I don't know, but I will NOT give up. I will save this plan and start back on it tomorrow. Work requires my attention!

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That Tutorial is brand new (posted Monday 21st) so I haven't seen/tried it,  let me have a play.......

 

Do you not like using the Auto Dormer Tool  or the Auto Floating Dormer Tool?

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**** Note to Others this Tutorial ONLY works IF you have Pro.  try this one if you have another title

http://www.homedesignersoftware.com/support/article/KB-00367/52/Home-Designer/Roofs/Drawing-a-Shed-Dormer-Manually.html

 

it does work though for me Bob, but not exactly per the tutorial ...not sure why

 

to get the walls to built you MUST uncheck the skylight checkbox in it's DBX

and

The skylight/roof hole must be big enough for the walls to be not impeded when they try to grow to full height.

            ( I did not need to designate the outer area as Attic ,walls went to full height automatically , and did not need to build the Gable end either)

 

The manual roof planes would not create their own Valleys , the trick in the Tutorial didn't work for me despite getting the warning message, so I had to do the valley manually.  neither this way or the way discussed in your other thread allow me to do a Gullwing roof on a dormer , you can set the walls with the upper pitch but the settings are ignored, at least in Pro 10....

 

I did not need to change the Roof Hole ,but was using a low pitch 5/12 so possibly didn't need too.

 

There is as so a new Tutorial on doing Gable Dormers for Pro , I just found too :

http://www.homedesignersoftware.com/support/article/KB-00236/167/Home-Designer/Roofs/Dormers/Building-a-Gable-Dormer-in-Home-Designer-Pro.html

 

I can post my practice Plan if you'd like it Bob , just let me know...

 

Mick

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Mick, I did "un-check" the skylight feature as I understood you want the hole for the skylight, but not the skylight. It may be the size of the roof opening. When I get the opportunity / time today (maybe) I will go back and enlarge the opening and see if it allows the walls to build. I tried both the auto dormer, and the floating-however one (I can't remember which, kept looking for a wall that wasn't there and I didn't understand (even after reading the ttrl) how to make it function. The other (again I don't remember which one) was to be used when you wanted a "fake" dormer, so there wouldn't be a hole in the roof.

 

If my patience holds out, I will get it! ;-)

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The floating dormer doesn't usually have any walls under it ( sits on Rafters) but it is not "fake" in the sense that it does cut a hole in the roof , with both types of auto dormer because it is placed as a defined size /slope/type etc (plan defaults) I usually get an error message which , I ignore , I then open the Dormer's DBX and change the roof pitch and type ,width etc until it will draw/auto generate, until that happens you will only have a grey box in plan view (nothing in 3D) but it instantly "appears" once it likes the input settings, you can then go about refining the design /look of the Dormer and it's placement.

If all your dormers are the same you can preset the style /height type etc in the Plan's defaults in Edit>Default>Dormer Tab before hand to get it close straight off.

did you "uncheck/check " both the skylight checkboxes ? plumb sides was other I think ? On my 1st try knowing walls were going to be coming up I made the skylight hole much bigger , then after the walls built I snapped the skylight sides back to the walls to close the roof hole. With Pro we can manually make a roof hole too , I think they used the skylight trick cause it is easier/quicker is all.

here is my practice plan Bob , not sure if it will help but might....


a Tut. on placing Auto Dormers I just found...

http://www.chiefarchitect.com/support/article/KB-00751/34/Chief-Architect/Roofs/Message%3A-Placing-an-automatic-dormer.html

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Just my 2 cents.  Here is what I have so far.

 

It's hard to make guesses without any of your dimensions or settings, because they really can change the way something turns out...or doesn't.

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tech support has been busy this week , there is now a separate section on the Knowledge Base (KB) under Roofs just for Dormers with 4 new Tuts. including the one #396 you used earlier but there is a new one with a longer explanation than the ChiefTalk Tut. too on Auto Dormers worth Reading.

 

http://www.homedesignersoftware.com/support/article/KB-00442/167/Home-Designer/Roofs/Dormers/Creating-an-Automatic-Dormer.html

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Morning Jo :) I see you got the gullwing roof to work on the Dormer , did you do anything special? what pitches did you use? , I can set the upper/lower no issues , the gullwing roof just doesn't generate as normal M.

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Good afternoon Mick,

Here is the upper floor with the manual dormer.  Notice the invisible wall keeping the dormer separate from the rest of the room?   Try moving that wall forward and backward  (while watching the roof in 3d) and see if your upper/lower pitch settings appear.  Weird.

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Thanks Jo , so the  Gullwing Roof will only generate if you place the invisible wall?  strange cos usually you can set upper/lower over anywall / anywhere and it works as prescribed .....how did you figure this out ? 

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Trial and error.   Lots of trial and error. :wacko:

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:)   actually I think  know why Rick dubbed you Q.O.W  there isn't anything I can think of that would lead me to believe that adding a invisible wall at the back of a dormer would lead to a Gullwing wing Roof --- if the settings for upper / lower are there.... that's wayyyyy outside the box thinking    :)    was it so you could get a room Definitionfor some reason?

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Mick,

I added the 2nd floor based on floor 1 (not a blank floor) with 0" ceiling height.  I then drew the dormer, but needed the invisible wall to give it room definition so that I could add ceiling height (to make it rise out of the roof, of course).   When I added the upper/lower pitch to the dormer roof, nothing changed.  THEN,  I noticed that when I moved that wall, the 2 pitches appeared!    :P

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I'll have to try it on a new plan cos I think it has something to do with the way you did it manually as adding that invisible wall means rebuilding my roof on the test plan which totally messed things up for some reason , I even lost the gullwing on the lower roof...very weird behaviour... I had the 2nd floor at 12" as that is what Bob wanted but not sure what else maybe different....

 

EDIT:  Finally figured out why it wasn't working for me , I didn't notice in your plan Jo, the dormer is on / touching the outer wall , mine weren't and it took a while before I realised I had the "Island Room Issue" and once I had an invisible wall connecting my dormer to an exterior wall, it built as expected. That invisible wall at the back has to be just inside the roof hole then you get the gullwing roof on the Dormer , however it totally messes up the inside view , the roof gets "little wings" which stick thru the roof + thru the drywall , I can see the little "wings" in your plan view too JoAnn, did you look inside the Attic? you also get an attic wall above the invisible wall (which can be made invisible too if needed.)

 

For those reading this with newer versions the Island Room issue is now automatically "fixed" by the program if the checkbox in preferences is set to do so AFAIK.

 

M.

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